git://git.nikiroo.be / gofetch.git / blame
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| 299a08f3 NR |
1 | STUDY FINDS PROBIOTICS 'NOT AS BENEFICIAL FOR GUT HEALTH AS \r |
| 2 | PREVIOUSLY THOUGHT' (THEGUARDIAN.COM) \r | |
| 3 | \r | |
| 4 | Thursday September 06, 2018 @11:30PM (BeauHD)\r | |
| 5 | from the contrary-to-popular-belief dept.\r | |
| 6 | \r | |
| 7 | o News link: https://science.slashdot.org/story/18/09/06/2153223/study-finds-probiotics-not-as-beneficial-for-gut-health-as-previously-thought\r | |
| 8 | o Source link: https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/sep/06/probiotics-not-as-beneficial-for-gut-health-as-previously-thought\r | |
| 9 | \r | |
| 10 | \r | |
| 11 | An anonymous reader quotes a report from The Guardian: The gut\r | |
| 12 | microbiome is the sum total of all the micro-organisms living\r | |
| 13 | in a person's gut, and has been shown to play a huge role in\r | |
| 14 | human health. New research has found probiotics -- usually\r | |
| 15 | taken as supplements or in foods such as yoghurt, kimchi or\r | |
| 16 | kefir -- can hinder a patient's gut microbiome from returning\r | |
| 17 | to normal after a course of antibiotics, and that different\r | |
| 18 | people respond to probiotics in dramatically different ways.\r | |
| 19 | In the first of two papers published in the journal Cell,\r | |
| 20 | researchers performed endoscopies and colonoscopies to sample\r | |
| 21 | and study the gut microbiomes of people who took antibiotics\r | |
| 22 | before and after probiotic consumption. Another group were\r | |
| 23 | given samples of their own gut microbiomes collected before\r | |
| 24 | consuming antibiotics. The researchers found the microbiomes\r | |
| 25 | of those who had taken the probiotics had suffered a "very\r | |
| 26 | severe disturbance." "Once the probiotics had colonized the\r | |
| 27 | gut, they completely inhibited the return of the indigenous\r | |
| 28 | microbiome which was disrupted during antibiotic treatment,"\r | |
| 29 | said Eran Elinav, an immunologist at the Weizmann Institute of\r | |
| 30 | Science in Israel and lead author on the studies. The\r | |
| 31 | scientists also compared the gut microbiomes of the gut\r | |
| 32 | intestinal tract of 25 volunteers with that of their stools.\r | |
| 33 | They found that stool bacteria only partially correlated with\r | |
| 34 | the microbiomes functioning inside their bodies. "So the fact\r | |
| 35 | that we all almost exclusively rely on stool in our microbiome\r | |
| 36 | research may not be a reliable way of studying gut microbiome\r | |
| 37 | health," said Elinav. In the second paper, the researchers\r | |
| 38 | examined the colonization and impact of probiotics on 15\r | |
| 39 | people by sampling within their gastrointestinal tract. They\r | |
| 40 | divided the individuals into two groups: one were given a\r | |
| 41 | preparation made of 11 strains of very commonly used\r | |
| 42 | probiotics and the other were given a placebo. Of those who\r | |
| 43 | were given probiotics, he said, "We could group the\r | |
| 44 | individuals into two distinct groups: one which resisted the\r | |
| 45 | colonisation of the probiotics, and one in which the\r | |
| 46 | probiotics colonized the gut and modified the composition of\r | |
| 47 | the gut microbiome and the genes of the host individual."\r | |
| 48 | \r | |
| 49 | \r | |
| 50 | ** \r | |
| 51 | \r | |
| 52 | ** Re: (Score:2)\r | |
| 53 | (by jblues ( 1703158 ))\r | |
| 54 | \r | |
| 55 | \r | |
| 56 | Bacteria are are naturally present in raw fruit and\r | |
| 57 | vegetables and naturally fermented foods, including naturally\r | |
| 58 | fermented bread. Most cold climate cultures relied on\r | |
| 59 | fermented vegetables to get them through the winter. Salt\r | |
| 60 | fermentation of raw vegetables allows the lactobacillus\r | |
| 61 | bacterias to proliferate. Almost all of the sugars are\r | |
| 62 | consumed, however most of the rest of nutritional profile is\r | |
| 63 | intact, including the vitamin C. In some cases the\r | |
| 64 | nutritional profile is enhanced. This is why viking sailors\r | |
| 65 | di\r | |
| 66 | \r | |
| 67 | \r | |
| 68 | ** Bitter sweet (Score:3, Informative)\r | |
| 69 | (by Anonymous Coward)\r | |
| 70 | \r | |
| 71 | \r | |
| 72 | Been saying this for years. I get some people have IBS but the\r | |
| 73 | reliance on things like yogurt is crazy.\r | |
| 74 | Fun little tip for a stomach ache - saliva. Let it build in your\r | |
| 75 | mouth (without water) and swallow in one gulp. Not only does it\r | |
| 76 | give your mouth a natural way to break down any bateria / sugar,\r | |
| 77 | but helps to calm your gut. Mouthwash is the nuclear option.\r | |
| 78 | So much of how your body functions comes down to diet. It's\r | |
| 79 | interesting they do not go into what foods were consumed.\r | |
| 80 | \r | |
| 81 | ** \r | |
| 82 | \r | |
| 83 | ** Re: (Score:3)\r | |
| 84 | (by omnichad ( 1198475 ))\r | |
| 85 | \r | |
| 86 | \r | |
| 87 | The "S" stands for syndrome, which identifies it as a\r | |
| 88 | collection of symptoms and not a disease. It's a diagnosis\r | |
| 89 | only in that there are good ways to treat the symptoms\r | |
| 90 | even when you don't understand the root cause fully.\r | |
| 91 | \r | |
| 92 | \r | |
| 93 | \r | |
| 94 | ** I guess it's back to (Score:2)\r | |
| 95 | (by bobstreo ( 1320787 ))\r | |
| 96 | \r | |
| 97 | \r | |
| 98 | shit transplants for the health crazed. /s\r | |
| 99 | Seriously, is anything really good or really bad for you in\r | |
| 100 | moderation?\r | |
| 101 | \r | |
| 102 | ** Don't take probiotic pills (Score:5, Insightful)\r | |
| 103 | (by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ))\r | |
| 104 | \r | |
| 105 | \r | |
| 106 | Don't waste your money on probiotic capsules. If you want to try\r | |
| 107 | to increase the amount or variety of bacteria in your guts,\r | |
| 108 | there are tons of delicious foods that are chock full of\r | |
| 109 | probiotics. Olives, pickles, fermented meats like the Italian\r | |
| 110 | delicacy soprasetta (which might be the tastiest thing ever\r | |
| 111 | invented by humans). Kimchi is also good, but it will make you\r | |
| 112 | smell bad, so if you're single, you might want to go easy on the\r | |
| 113 | kimchi.\r | |
| 114 | Also, if you use vinegar on salads, try getting some of that\r | |
| 115 | good cider vinegar that still has the "mother" in it. Shake the\r | |
| 116 | bottle and use like any other vinegar. And of course, yogurt,\r | |
| 117 | kefir, that kind of stuff is delicious too.\r | |
| 118 | I'm not crazy about kombucha. It's a big fad now and there are\r | |
| 119 | places here in California that have kombucha on tap, but it's\r | |
| 120 | not really to my taste. Some people swear by it. I notice that\r | |
| 121 | now when you buy it in the store, they ask for an ID since\r | |
| 122 | there's a small amount of alcohol in it.\r | |
| 123 | Also, alcohol is not really good for your gut bacteria, but\r | |
| 124 | there are more important things in life than gut bacteria, you\r | |
| 125 | know? Just eat a lot of different kinds of food and you'll end\r | |
| 126 | up with good gut bacteria without even trying.\r | |
| 127 | \r | |
| 128 | ** Re: Don't take probiotic pills (Score:3)\r | |
| 129 | (by ljw1004 ( 764174 ))\r | |
| 130 | \r | |
| 131 | \r | |
| 132 | Why would you advise people on natural sources of probiotics\r | |
| 133 | - in response to an article which said that they're either\r | |
| 134 | ineffectual or actually bad?\r | |
| 135 | \r | |
| 136 | ** Re: (Score:2)\r | |
| 137 | (by omnichad ( 1198475 ))\r | |
| 138 | \r | |
| 139 | \r | |
| 140 | They likely contain a lot more biodiversity vs. a\r | |
| 141 | monoculture or handful of strains in probiotic\r | |
| 142 | supplements. And they would still probably be ineffectual\r | |
| 143 | most of the time, except after antibiotic use. This study\r | |
| 144 | doesn't cover any of that. Of course if you're trying to\r | |
| 145 | feed the microbiome you already have, eating unfermented\r | |
| 146 | vegetables makes more sense as they still have the complex\r | |
| 147 | sugars like oligosaccharides, fructans and so on that\r | |
| 148 | would feed it. That depends on whether you are\r | |
| 149 | repopulating after an\r | |
| 150 | \r | |
| 151 | \r | |
| 152 | ** Re: (Score:2)\r | |
| 153 | (by PopeRatzo ( 965947 ))\r | |
| 154 | \r | |
| 155 | \r | |
| 156 | > Why would you advise people on natural sources of\r | |
| 157 | > probiotics - in response to an article which said that\r | |
| 158 | > they're either ineffectual or actually bad?\r | |
| 159 | Because on the high probability that this new "study"\r | |
| 160 | actually gets overturned by future research, I want people\r | |
| 161 | to know they can eat delicious healthy food.\r | |
| 162 | Remember when fats were bad? And coffee? And wine was good\r | |
| 163 | for you? And eggs were bad for you? And low-fat diets were\r | |
| 164 | good for losing weight?\r | |
| 165 | And chocolate was bad for you? Do you need me to go on?\r | |
| 166 | When\r | |
| 167 | \r | |
| 168 | \r | |
| 169 | \r | |
| 170 | ** Makes sense to me. (Score:5, Informative)\r | |
| 171 | (by Vegan Cyclist ( 1650427 ))\r | |
| 172 | \r | |
| 173 | \r | |
| 174 | Most probiotics are a pretty small range of bacteria, and I\r | |
| 175 | don't know if I've ever seen anywhere that confirms these are\r | |
| 176 | actually the ones we want on a large scale...especially when\r | |
| 177 | some supplements have pretty large doses of these.\r | |
| 178 | From all the reading I've done it seems the best direction will\r | |
| 179 | be to focus on prebiotics, aka the foods that the microbiome\r | |
| 180 | thrives on, which is typically fibrous vegetable matter. Feed\r | |
| 181 | the good ones you've got (rather than trying to implant others),\r | |
| 182 | and you'll probably be better off.\r | |
| 183 | \r | |
| 184 | ** This study is done by morons (Score:2)\r | |
| 185 | (by gurps_npc ( 621217 ))\r | |
| 186 | \r | |
| 187 | \r | |
| 188 | What idiot thinks that if you give pills of a specific biome you\r | |
| 189 | will get something BESIDES that specific biome???? Look, if you\r | |
| 190 | take probiotic pills, you are replacing your normal biome WITH\r | |
| 191 | the biome of the pills.\r | |
| 192 | That was the presumed GOAL of taking the pills. The fact that\r | |
| 193 | your biome change is the thing you were trying to do, that's why\r | |
| 194 | you take the pills.\r | |
| 195 | If you have a blue car, and then paint it with red paint you are\r | |
| 196 | an idiot if you complain that the car is no longer red.\r | |
| 197 | There are lots of good reas\r | |
| 198 | \r | |
| 199 | ** Re: (Score:2)\r | |
| 200 | (by omnichad ( 1198475 ))\r | |
| 201 | \r | |
| 202 | \r | |
| 203 | > Look, if you take probiotic pills, you are replacing your\r | |
| 204 | > normal biome WITH the biome of the pills.\r | |
| 205 | The study concluded the opposite (in all cases except with\r | |
| 206 | antibiotic use). And the results are surprising. What it\r | |
| 207 | sounds like is happening is that all of the bacteria in the\r | |
| 208 | probiotic compete for food with the biofilm in your\r | |
| 209 | intestines. However, the probiotic has no way to supplant the\r | |
| 210 | biofilm - that's a protective layer that keeps out competing\r | |
| 211 | bacteria. It just starves the resident population a little\r | |
| 212 | bit as it passes on through. Either way, more or less none of\r | |
| 213 | it stays behind and it all leaves t\r | |
| 214 | \r | |
| 215 | \r | |
| 216 | \r |